- cross-posted to:
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- cross-posted to:
- technology@beehaw.org
- privacy@lemmy.ml
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DO NOT GIVE THEM YOUR PHONE
DO NOT TALK TO POLICE
Your ONLY responses should be to identify yourself, and “I will not make any statements without my lawyer present.”
They only need to be 500 miles near you, if they pay for the good juicy 2G exploits 😉
A lot of countries have disabled their 2G networks (and 3G in some cases). I think 4G and 5G have a more secure signaling protocol than SS7?
Australia is currently in the process of phasing out 3g, which is annoying cause a 3g hotspot is the only way I can consistently get my 2ds connected to the internet
Hu? Hotspot is wifi, so what Generation of mobile Network is used should not impact that. The problem with DS would only be wpa2 not supported, but that does not matter, if you do not set a password.
It’s not possible not to it you want to visit USA. If you don’t, they’ll reject your visa or deny entry. Thr only way is to use brand new cheap android before or after ( after is better ) and resell it once you go back. Most corporations do so
So the answer is to not visit the US then.
it’s a policy that has never let me down
Don’t you want to see our amazing 200 years as a nation and 500 years of massacre sites??!!?
No, but your weird obsession with ridiculously unhealthy food is somewhat interesting.
The obesity rate in Australia (and New Zealand) isn’t very far behind the USA…
Agreed.
And the causes are probably broadly similar; lack of education about how to cook, lack of time to cook, lack of education on healthy food, too much food advertising, ultra-processed foods are too common, healthy foods are expensive…
does this apply to other countries
You have to suspect, I fear. At least, those exploiting tools are very expensive. So there is this little roadblock. On the other hand, a lot of this money goes to an Isreal based company…
What if the country did not support israel and does not recognize it
Pro tip, if you suspect the police are going to take your phone, turn it off. As far as I am aware, finger print and face id do not work on initial startup and they can’t console you to enter your pin without a warrant.
If you have an iPhone, holding down either volume button and the side button will bring out the Medical ID, slide to power off, Emergency SOS screen. This will also disable FaceID. Password will be required to access the phone now.
Better yet: don’t use biometrics. My phone has face recognition for unlocking, but I better stick to a PIN/PASSWORD.
Or better yet just don’t use a phone at all! Can’t make you unlock what you don’t have!
Just hold Side button and one of the volume buttons to deactivate biometrics
Double check this in the state or country you’re in. I recall something from a few years ago where the police could force you to give a swipe pattern and maybe pin since these items are not covered in the same way that a password is.
Maybe in some countries but in a western one they aren’t getting a pattern or passcode unless you verbally give it to them. We do know though that there is some level of capability to crack phones though.
Indent to find an article to back up what I remember and in 2020, a woman was held in contempt of court and jailed for refusing to provide a passcode. The case was later overturned.
How can you be forced to input a pattern/PIN?
My phone has a “Lockdown” option in the power menu. It usually makes it require the pin and fingerprint won’t be available until unlocked again.
*counsel you. I’m picturing a police officer comforting a suspect who’s sobbing with a hand on their shoulder haha.
Not counsel, compel actually. But either way, definitely not console! Ha
What’s a lemon party? I should Google it.
Election season is right around the corner, join us! Lemonparty.org
Seems like the cops should now be worried about civilian phones exploding and now might consider shooting anyone that tries to hand them a phone /s
The more comments and news I read about the US the more Orwellian it feels.
You guys really need a massive left-shift away from the omnipresent government which regulates bodies more than companies.
Where do you live?
European Union FTW, Germany specifically where the CCC is a massive counter measure to uneducated politics.
Yes. We must know where they live so we can shit on their country to make ourselves feel better.
'Merica!
IDK I just had a overwhelming sense they were in the UK, which is like… way worse.
You are 66 times more likely to be killed by a police officer if you are in the US compared to in the UK.
Oh we’re talking about police killings suddenly? I thought we were talking about civil rights?
The comment was talking about things being Orwellian. Is it not Orwellian to have police killing many, many civilians?
There’s other things.
For example, the UK is the most surveiled populace over any whole country. Which is neat.
Oh sorry instead we’re going to get fascism
The whole Western world is at this point, it’s so depressing. Even when the left seems to win democratically people like Macron nakedly abuse their authority and choose to caucus with the fascists over the social democrats.
This is what happens if you stop developing your democracy and chill on the work people from the past have started to develop
Happens all the time, if you look into history
At some point, someone is going to figure out George Orwell was actually a time traveler, and he tried to fix things with books. He had to deliver the message that way because if he just shouted in the streets the things that were going to happen, he’d been written off as a madman. Change a few details here and there… and then sell it as “fiction”…
Frankly, George Orwell is part of the problem. Aside from a brief stint during the Spanish Civil War where he supported the CNT-FAI, he spent the overwhelming majority of his life supporting the British Empire and relentlessly hating Communists (and other socialists and members of minority groups) of all stripes, to the point where even the British government told him to chill the fuck out because they were allied with the Soviets. His books aren’t immensely popular in extremely right wing countries because they have a left wing critique of government overreach, they’re popular because they are anti-government in exactly the same vague and malleable way that all populist right wingers are.
I have been to a few spots over there and it is crazy how different culturally it is. Nothing is away from politics and cops get called fot eeeeverything.
deleted by creator
Just save a picture/scan of it in whichever secure password manager you use. It’s good enough for most uses.
For iOS. You can just hold down the lock and volume up button and it will require your passcode. 5x lock works too but I feel the former is easier.
You can show your wallet with your phone locked. Settings > Face ID & Passcode > Allow access when locked > Wallet
Or you could just hit restart on the phone and at least on android it asks for the code first before enabling finger print or face ID.
For Android:
- Open Settings
- Search for “Lockdown”
- Select “Show Lockdown option” from the results, or the result that most resembles that.
- Enter your pin if required.
- Tap the associated slider to enable Show lockdown option
Now when you hold your power button, you get a “lockdown” option that disables biometrics and forces you to enter your passcode for the next unlock.
Particularly useful for me, as I have my phone set up to always be unlocked if my watch is close enough (maybe stupid of me), but I can force lock it at any time.
Also relevant:
On some phones you won’t get anything when searching for “lockdown” but you most likely have it, it’s typically under Display > Lock screen > Shown lockdown option.
I appreciate you.
On iOS 18 there is a power button in the top right of control center (you have to hold it)
*especially if you’ve got nothing to hide.
Mark my words.
For many of us, this is a “No shit Sherlock” moment.
But in 10 years, we will have young people going “Uh what really?”
Remember when we used to say, “Don’t put your name on the internet?” And now it’s everywhere?
Remember when we used to say, “Don’t put your name on the internet?” And now it’s everywhere?
Mine isn’t, go ahead and look it up. You won’t find my name anywhere in the internet.
Here it is encrypted so only you can read it: >!John Jacob Jingleheimer Schmidt!<
Woah that’s my name too
Hey! That’s my name too!
Hey what the heck? How did you get my Lemmy password?
All I see is *******
Hunter2
This meme is 20 years old now, I bet there are kids repeating it who weren’t alive when it was first made and don’t even know where it comes from.
Fuck I’m old, how could you do this to me?
Well, bash.org is gone, so…
Yeah I remember the early days of the internet when no one used their real name and we had relationships with dozens of people who we had no idea where they lived and what their real names were.
It seems quaint, but I kinda liked it like that.
Its still like that on discord. Have no idea what one of my closest friends name is, but he really loves opossums and Minecraft!
I don’t see what the difference would be in 10 years.
I don’t think 90% of people, especially “young people” would avoid doing this already. It’s already a major awareness/compliance issue, and not at all a “no shit sherlock” moment.
But what did you have in mind that will be different in 10 years? Paricularly for young people.
That was like the biggest thing i learned in computer class, that i already knew in 2002 or so. Later myspace became a thing, and everyone had a myspace name. Then facebook and some people used their real name. Then facebook asked you for your phone number, and i thought: well, that’s silly, who in their right mind would do that. Turns out the answer is everyone.
All this makes it sound like police are giving you a bunch of time to respond and addressing you politely.
I mean, I agree on the principle. Don’t just hand your phone over to… anyone, really. But the game becomes very different when a guy with a gun is hassling you over it.
This is why I set up tasker to lockdown my phone under certain conditions, such as: getting disconnected from Bluetooth (like when my phone is separated from me and my watch, my headphones, or the car), getting disconnected from WiFi (like when it’s taken from where it’s supposed to be), getting a slight jolt from the accelerometer (like getting thrown to the ground or even just a swift tap). My phone may get locked down a bunch during day to day stuff, but at least I know it will lockdown automatically when it matters.
But aPpLe CaRe AbOuT pRiVaCy
Is article mixing things or am I missing something?
You don’t need to hand over your phone to present a digital ID. At least in my country the digital ID just creates a qr that the cop can scan to verify. There is no reason to hand over anything on the whole process.
Does your phone need to be unlocked to show that qr code?
Of course. But if a police officer were to remove your phone by force, first it would be illegal without a warrant so it would almost made you a favour as all evidence in your phone would be invalid in court.
Then if they just want to remove by force, with or without warrant, they can just take it from your pocket. Even locked if they want the info in your phone they are probably getting it. They would have access to some of the best forensics teams and equipment.
Following the same logic, should we never have an unlocked phone near a police officer? I don’t know about that.
And if you are just that paranoid I would probably be easy to just have a second profile on your phone just for the ID. And you are the same as if having the phone locked as password is needed for changing profiles.
But if a police officer were to remove your phone by force, first it would be illegal without a warrant so it would almost made you a favour as all evidence in your phone would be invalid in court.
Even if what they find on your phone isn’t valid in court, it can still lead them to other things that are valid. For instance, a picture taken at a specific place with a timestamp. That picture may not be admissible, but if they find CCTV footage of you at that time and place, you’re screwed.
Cops can and will overreach their powers, and they’ll probably get away with it.
Even locked if they want the info in your phone they are probably getting it. They would have access to some of the best forensics teams and equipment.
Sure, but it’s a lot harder for them if your phone is encrypted and shut off before you encounter them.
Following the same logic, should we never have an unlocked phone near a police officer? I don’t know about that.
You really shouldn’t. Cops are never on your side.
You really shouldn’t. Cops are never on your side.
I mean never is a strong word here. People are saved by cops every day. At least in my country. Just looking today news: women was arrested after being violent towards doctors in La Palma. Pretty sure doctors though cops were on their side.
You have to be sure to defend your citizen rights and prosecuted rights (if it even become to that). But that does not conflict to call the cops if you need to and if you are being victim of a crime they’ll most likely help you. Once again, that’s how it is where I live.
In the US, cops are legally allowed to just ignore you.
There was a case in Colorado I believe where an estranged husband kidnapped his kids from their mom. The mom went to the police but they kept brushing her off. After while the dad showed up to the station with a gun, promptly got killed, and then the kids were discovered dead in his car.
It went to the courts, and courts came back with “yeah they don’t HAVE to help you.” Of course this is overly simplified, but there’s case law in at least part of the country now that allows cops to ignore anyone at their discretion because they’re on dinner break or just not feeling it.
Also in the US, cops can tear your car up on a minor traffic stop because they “smelled” something. If they search your vehicle for whatever reason, they can decide they want to throw all you stuff out on the road, cut open your upholstery, take door panels off, etc. And if they don’t find anything? “Have a good day sir, get your shit off the road it’s a public safety hazard.” Then drive off leaving you to pick up their mess. And yes it has happened, and no not just once.
There was a case in New York where a guy was going around stabbing people. Cops posted up looking for him of course. Guy on the subway got stabbed nearly to death, a bystander tried to help the victim and took the criminal off-guard. Cops came in from the operators cab and subdued the criminal. They were watching the whole thing from the operators window and didn’t help the victim until they saw an opening created by the bystander. Literally watching a guy on his way to getting stabbed to death and only decided to intervene when they felt like it.
Also the Uvalde school shooting. Just hanging out in hallways while kids get shot, waiting for the danger to clear.
Also George Floyd but at least some amount of justice has been served there. But I’m highly skeptical it would have came to that if the case wasn’t as well-known as it was. Shit happens all the time. They have a term they love to bust out for minorities who are acting out of line. “Excited Delirium”: look it up.
I could go on, but I think you get the idea. They “can” help, but totally not a requirement.
I will admit I’m making some strong, harsh statements. But I think that’s a pretty natural result of living in the U.S., a country who’s cops operate closer to a gang than Rescue Heroes. They kill minorities with virtual immunity. They racially profile people. The list goes on.
Somebody who intentionally joins a group like that does not have good intentions, or is ok with their buddies not having good intentions, or gets kicked out quickly for tattling on their fellow cops. So yeah, cops are never on your side, at least not here.
Even locked if they want the info in your phone they are probably getting it. They would have access to some of the best forensics teams and equipment.
I think some of the concern is when cops will use force illegally and then lie about it, so they wouldn’t necessarily have access to forensics.
Like taking your phone and go through your WhatsApp messages?
If that’s a concern you could set up a password to access any sensible app or chat within that app.
I think that is a more sensible approach. As if you are targeted by any reason an undercover cop could get a hold on your unlocked phone by many different ways.
Seems like a good use for android app pinning, I think that locks the phone to that app until unlocked
Brazil? I do miss being able to leave home bringing only my phone because my ID and cards are all there
I’m also from Brazil. I chose to refuse any digital IDs: for example, my CNH (for non-brazilians: it’s our driver’s license) is physical and I used a dumbphone (Multilaser Zapp) to justify to the bureau that I can’t have apps for digital IDs (I kinda could within my other device, a smartphone, but I lied having only Multilaser as device). They can’t force people to have digital IDs, yet. Not everyone has a smartphone, it’s common in Brazil for a house/family/community to have multiple people using one single smartphone, digital IDs won’t be usable for this situation. It’s not my situation, I avoid to take my smartphone outside of home due to security concerns, so I take a dumbphone instead.
Digital IDs have multiple problems. What if the smartphone breaks? What if the smartphone has no battery when one needs to show one’s IDs? These were the factors that motivated me to refuse any digital IDs.
I’m a cop and I can tell you that, at least in my country, you’d have no reason to not unlock your phone if you haven’t done anything.
I can understand that in some countries cops can be seen as criminals (and are behaving like criminals), but I don’t think a generality should be made. Just like a generality shouldn’t be made about people from an origin all doing the same bad thing.
Also don’t take advices from what you see on Lemmy as every user comes from a different country with different laws.
In my country, we can take your phone but we aren’t allowed to unlock it without your consent or without a prosecutor saying so.
“It’s rude to not let me invade your privacy. If you have nothing to hide just let me see your phone!” Fuck off, pig
🐽🐽🐽🐽🐽🐽🐽🐽🐽🐽🐽
Fuck you
I’m a cop and I can tell you that, at least in my country, you’d have no reason to not unlock your phone if you haven’t done anything.
I can understand that in some countries cops can be seen as criminals (and are behaving like criminals), but I don’t think a generality should be made.
It sounds like you’re saying that you would assume that someone had done something illegal if they refused to unlock their phone for you. It’s a bit ironic that you then immediately say that people shouldn’t generalize about cops behaving as criminals.
I don’t let my friends go through my phone. Cop or not, why would I let a stranger?
Because your friend would just be doing it out of curiosity, not as part of an investigation.
I’m not saying that anyone not unlocking their phone has done something illegal, but just that some people who are refusing to give something willingly to the police is making them waste precious time which could be used to catch up with the bad guy.
Again I can only talk about my country and maybe in the US cops are awful, I don’t know. But I know that family of victims would love people to just cooperate with the police and not make them waste time…
Because your friend would just be doing it out of curiosity, not as part of an investigation.
It doesn’t matter why my friend wants to use my phone. If a friend wants to use my computer, I log out and sign into a guest account that doesn’t have access to my private documents. That’s not an option on my phone. It doesn’t matter if my friend has a legitimate reason to want to look at something on my phone. Maybe they want to see a picture I took last Friday - if they tell me that, I’ll just pull it up and share it with them.
If my phone has something on it that can help the police and the police tell me what they’re looking for, I can check my phone myself and share specifically that information with them.
If my phone doesn’t have that information, I can tell them that, too.
This is the exact same as with my friends. The difference is that the police are much more likely to be antagonistic and much less likely to tell me what they want.
If the police can’t articulate what they’re looking for or if they don’t trust me to tell me what it is, then I DEFINITELY don’t trust them to look at my phone themselves. And heck, that’s true of my friends, too.
If I hand a police officer my phone unlocked, what’s stopping them from hooking it up to GrayKey or Cellebrite or some other similar tool, and dumping all the data from my phone without my knowledge - whether for legitimate or nefarious purposes? What stops them from doing this “out of curiosity?” This isn’t generally a risk with my friends, but it’s always a risk when dealing with the police.
In the US, when there’s suspicion of police wrongdoing, the police investigate themselves (and either conclude that nobody did anything wrong or that only one person did something wrong but everyone else is fine). It’s so bad that it’s a meme (“We’ve investigated ourselves and found no evidence of any wrongdoing.”) But even if you don’t have the police investigating themselves in your country, it’s still the government doing that investigation. And nothing makes the government inherently trustworthy.
As a private citizen of your country who was legitimately concerned that the police are retaining more data than necessary, could I visit the police station and ask them to give me supervised admin access to their computers (as well as the personal computers of anyone who might have had access to my device or to the data extracted from it), as well as full access to the station itself in case there are any unaccounted for computers, so that I can confirm that the police aren’t overstepping? If not, why not? It’s not like the police have anything to hide, right? And the sooner that the police cooperate and that information is shared with me, the sooner I can rest easy knowing I and my fellow citizens have not been victimized by the police.
Hopefully you see how ridiculous it is for me to expect someone to just give me access to all of that information. That’s actually less ridiculous than a police officer asking me to hand them my unlocked phone.
As a private citizen, I have to trust that police and government officials are doing their jobs properly. If they don’t, I can have my privacy invaded or be framed for a crime, with no method for recourse. And without any real accountability. I have to trust a police officer if I hand him my phone, and I’m the only one risking anything. In the opposite scenario, if I overstep while they’re supervising me reviewing their systems, they can hold me accountable immediately.
Well thanks for your precise answer. It’s nice to have some civilized people being able to just discuss about a topic.
We can just agree to disagree before I leave the topic 😅
In a recent study it was found that around 2/5 of phones held by police had signs of tampering, including when they are supposed to get a warrant. If you want to know more Google, "40% police study " and it will probably show up on the first page.
I cannot know with 100% certainty that someone hasn’t planted false evidence on my phone, so I absolutely have reason turn my phone off before surrendering it (if I’m forced to surrender it).
If cops are certain I’ve committed a crime, why do they need to rely on methods outside the law to get me? No, I’m never going to consent to any sort of search without a warrant. If you think I have something to hide, why are you afraid to get a warrant?
That’s the thing, often you don’t know if someone has committed a crime and looking into their phone can also prove that they’re not guilty.
I ain’t talking about any method outside of the law. Willingly cooperating isn’t illegal. Nothing forces you to be friendly with your neighbors, but being friendly with your neighbor isn’t illegal.
Sorry, by “outside of the law” I meant apart from legally compelling someone. The word choice made it sound like I meant illegal methods. I meant volunteering information. I don’t think people should ever do it. I’ve edited that in for clarity.
It’s my personal opinion that the police should not even be allowed to request voluntary searches, but that’s a different topic and one I recognize as more extremist. It’s just too easy for requests to sound like demands in a society with manners. Phrases like “Would you please do X?” are often used for both optional things and required things because “Do X” sounds rude to people.
I’m going to preface this by saying the whole Americanised ACAB stuff is silly. Not everywhere has a shitty, militarised police force like theirs. Where I am, my experience with the police has been pretty positive, even with me being an immigrant with darker skin.
But man, no.
If police want your data, they can ask you politely, and if you say no, then that should be it. End of discussion. People have the right to privacy.
Maybe the officer wouldn’t do anything nefarious. But then again, maybe they will. You have no way of knowing what type of person that officer is. Even good police forces have plenty of shitty employees, so police powers should be limited to avoid them just doing whatever they want.
If there’s a genuine reason to have your data, say you’re implicated in some investigation, then they can go through the proper channels and get a warrant.
Police absolutely should not have the power to just do whatever they like. If you let them, have that, it leads to shitty police forces like they have in the US and elsewhere.
I totally agree with you and that’s what we have in my country.
At least someone on Lemmy is not jumping on the ACAB stuff train.
People are the first one to criticize us (sometimes with good reasons) but they are the first one to call us when they are in deep shit.
Would it be fair to summarize your point as “if you have nothing to hide you have nothing to fear”?
Man, fuck that.
It’s none of your business what’s on our phones, period.
You want access? Go through due process.
The very fact that you led off with “you’re fine if you have nothing to hide” makes you the problem, you personally, not anyone else around you, you.
Doesn’t matter what country you’re in at all. Doesn’t even matter what the law says in this case, because crappy laws exist.
That kind of thinking is exactly why people don’t trust cops.
Cops are garbage
Says the guy insulting a stranger based on their profession
Yes because their profession is garbage.
I don’t know why your getting downvoted and have replies with ACAB…
Keep in mind I come at this from an American perspective.
I do have to disagree with the first paragraph. You do not need to access to or to search my phone to perform your job. If the phone becomes part of a criminal investigation then ideally a warrant would be put out by a judge and a Computer Forensics team would take it from there.
At least in the USA, the bad perception of cops is not just because of their apparent lack of accountability and ability to get away with murder, but also how expansive the scope of their duties are. So much authority intrusted in one person clearly seems to go to their heads more often than not here.
I understand in many European countries the scope of a cops duties is much more restricted. I know Britian doesn’t even provide their law enforcement with firearms.
ACAB piggly wiggly
Don’t besmirch the good name of Piggly Wiggly. https://www.pigglywigglystores.com/
I can understand that in some countries cops can be seen as criminals (and are behaving like criminals), but I don’t think a generality should be made. Just like a generality shouldn’t be made about people from an origin all doing the same bad thing.
ACAB, and you don’t get to compare your chosen profession to where people were born or the colour of their skin, nor try to claim victim points by pretending you are systemically oppressed and discriminated against in the same way we are (though your trying to does go to strengthen my first point).
Fuck you, pig.
How exactly is an individual supposed to determine which cops will be good and which will abuse their power?
Just as we can’t make a general statement that all cops are definitely bad, you can’t make a general statement that all cops in any particular country or town will be good.
From a basic risk management viewpoint, it doesn’t make sense for anyone to accept the risk that any given cop won’t abuse their position, even if we were willing to accept that very few would actually do so.
Cops have an extremely privileged status in society and the amount of damage that a bad one can do to an individual - on purpose or even by accident - is incalculable, including setting up an innocent person for capital punishment as we’re seeing unfold in Missouri right now.
I agree with you, you can’t know for sure that you’re with a good or bad cop.
But you also have to comply with laws if you don’t want to get in trouble.
I can only answer for my country and I can tell you that here you’re gonna waste way less time if you show what’s in your phone and we can see that you’re innocent.
The time not wasted there might also be used to catch the person who’s really guilty.
I’ll just give you an example even if it’s not reated to unlocking phones: A black BMW 335i is filmed hitting a pedestrian and the plate number finishes with a 5. We’re gonna need to have a look at every BMW within these parameters. If you prevent the police from checking your car by hiding it, a guilty guy might have more time to hide his car and a crime is gonna go unpunished, leaving a victim with no one to pay for his injuries.
Of course, that reality might be different elsewhere. It’s just that I have noticed that on Lemmy cops are only seen as bad guys when, in my case, I spend a lot of time helping people.
I’ll just give you an example even if it’s not reated to unlocking phones: A black BMW 335i is filmed hitting a pedestrian and the plate number finishes with a 5. We’re gonna need to have a look at every BMW within these parameters. If you prevent the police from checking your car by hiding it, a guilty guy might have more time to hide his car and a crime is gonna go unpunished, leaving a victim with no one to pay for his injuries.
And if my car was in an unrelated accident but just happened to fit those criteria, you could use that as evidence against me (and not only that, but then stop trying to solve the crime because you’ve assumed the perpetrator.) It ALWAYS goes both ways. If the only way you can solve a crime is by violating people’s privacy without a warrant, maybe don’t be a cop.
Cops are seen as bad guys because people like you argue for why rights shouldn’t apply to people, and making you get a warrant (aka doing your job) is seen as interfering with a crime.
The worst part is, it is stupidly easy to get warrants here in the US, but the cops WILL make your life miserable if you make them get one.
So you’re advocating for fewer civil rights (or at least for people not to exercise their civil rights) because it saves you time and money? Spoken like a true pig.
If someone from your family gets abducted and the police can ask your neighbors to cooperate and give information without everyone just using a right to remain silent or lie, I’m sure you would be happy with the time gained to help you find your family member.
Ill take 400 on “things that don’t actually happen” Ghost of Alex!!
https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/kidnappings-per-country
You may want to consider in your made-up scenario the reason behind an entire neighbourhood refusing to give any information.
If you have a problem, and you call the cops, now you have two problems.
Well said!
