megane-kun

I’d be worried about not really being able to make my own decisions and not having someone there to help me out.

I don’t know about you, but I sure hope I’d be able to check out before that time comes for me. Before my mind and body becomes too feeble, I’d like to be able to just nope out.

Even if it were possible, I still would not prefer to have any kids.

First off, I haven’t even been a “proper adult”, and probably would never be. How can I be expected to raise a child with the care and love they deserve when I don’t even have my life sorted out? Even if you argue that I’d have to change once having a child, I’ve also seen people fail to change even after having children they swore they loved even more than their own life.

Secondly, we’ve already got enough people that are unwanted and abandoned. Why not take better care of people we already have now?

Lastly, parenting is a huge commitment. It’s not just about you and your “legacy”, but another life that will suffer for your mistakes. For those who are up to the task and willingly take on the responsibility, thank you and best of luck!

Because why not? I’m alive by default, and I’m too lazy to change that.

First OS: Windows 3.1 running on top of MS-DOS 6.2

First Linux distro: Ubuntu (forgot the version, but it was circa 2018).

If I’d count an OS/Linux distro that I’ve used even if not in a machine I own, it’d be Linux Mint of circa 2006.

NO

Neither do I self-identify as a tankie, I don’t think anyone who’d identify themselves as tankies would think of me as one.

“Going into Happyland” sounds like a great euphemism. I’m going to steal it if you don’t mind.

And that’s perhaps the most peaceful peace. A‌ peace only nothingness can bring.

There are other options other than this one that requires permission. The article mentions her reasons to choose this method.

From the article:

She had thought about taking her own life but the violent death by suicide of a schoolfriend and its impact on the girl’s family deterred her.

Whether we agree with her or not, it’s her decision.

And while I don’t think that’s exactly what you meant, it’s how it comes across. Almost all of your points are some variation of who’s gonna pay for their treatment and take care of their physical needs.

Indeed, that’s not what exactly what I meant. Thanks for giving me the benefit of the doubt.

My main point can be summarized in that second to the last paragraph, which I doubt has communicated things adequately.

To reiterate: it won’t be initiated by the medical professionals. They’re simply there to ensure that someone applying for this procedure are indeed “proceeding of their own accord and have made sure options have been considered”. The waiting period is there to make sure that not only they’ve arrived at this decision after careful deliberation, but also to force them to consider and try out the options available to them. The process can be terminated at any point by the patient, and the final step will not proceed without their permission.

My point is that mental illness is much less understood than physical illness, and I wouldn’t trust any diagnosis that said the condition could never be resolved.

I accept this point. This is why I‌ put the emphasis on the decision of the patient. And this is where I think our positions fundamentally differ. Promising treatments may or may not be there, may or may not be there in the immediate or far future, but it’s on the patient to consider. The medical professionals are there to ensure that the patient has considered available options, and have exerted reasonable effort to improve their situation. Whether or not the patient has made “the correct decision” isn’t the point—but rather whether or not the patient has made an informed and well-thought-out decision.

I share your opinion that in an ideal world, this shouldn’t even be needed. That even though the option would be there for anyone to take, no one will take it in an ideal world. But we are not in such an ideal world. We can strengthen our social safety nets to help people suffering from the debilitating effects of mental illness (among other sources of suffering), and that will do a lot of good, but until we arrive at a society which no longer needs a dignified exit because no one ever wants to exit, I am of the opinion of giving them that option.

I share a lot of your questions about this, but the following parts made me uncomfortable agreeing with you:

People who are seeking death are rarely in the kind of headspace where I think they are able to meaningfully consent to that?

And this feels meaningfully different than the case of a 90yo who’s body is slowly failing them. This is an otherwise healthy young person.

She has the following to say about that: “People think that when you’re mentally ill, you can’t think straight, which is insulting.”

Mental illness is an illness, and can be chronic and progressive. They can cause someone to be unable to carry on living, maintaining a livelihood, afford their own medication, psychiatric visits and therapy that they would need to even want to live in the first place. That’s not even to go into the absolute hell people in such situations can go through everyday.

We can debate on what constitutes “a well-thought-out decision that takes into consideration every available option” and I would actually say that one should give those options a try, but to deny that a mentally ill person can make their own EOL decisions makes me terribly uncomfortable.

In my opinion, sure, there should be a waiting period, to filter out those chronic episodes that lead to spur-of-the moment impulses, or decisions that are strongly linked to temporary conditions. This waiting period can be used to think things through, prove that they’ve tried means available to them, or even give them the chance to try the means they wouldn’t have had access to otherwise (like specialized help, therapy that wouldn’t have been available to them, etc). Now, I think what happens next is up to these medical professionals: do they deem one’s condition to be intractable and no amount of medication and therapy and counseling can make a difference? If they deem the situation to be hopeless, and the patient agrees, then yeah, the patient can make their exit. Otherwise, the medication, therapy, counseling or whatever it is that they’ve been trying should continue. If funds are needed for this to continue, then so be it. Those people who want to be no exits can be counted upon to fund this, right? Those people denying exit should put their money where their mouths are.

If signing up to an EOL waiting list could be the way for people to consider their situation and try out things that might help them, then so be it.

Oh, sorry, I’ve been rambling. My point is, yeah, there should be a waiting period that would double as a chance for people to get the help they need (but don’t have access to or maybe the motivation to). And more importantly, that anyone, and I mean anyone (okay, there’d be a triage system in place, but just allow everyone in, and sort them out once they’re in) can sign up.

The way I imagine things would go is I can just walk into some office, inform the person in the counter that I want to have a passport to neverwhere, and they’d ask me to file some paperwork and after a few days, I’d be in a clinic where someone would perform a psychological check-up on me, and do some interviews. Then after a few more days, some doctor will be informing me of my diagnosis and options—or perhaps just flat out saying I’m completely mentally healthy and my petition is denied (if I’m lucky maybe given a list of people to contact to help with my problems). If I’m continuing the process, then I’d choose which option I want, go with the treatment or other, and like, hopefully continue until I can manage my situation with minimal help!

Do we really need people to sign up for a passport to the great beyond just to get the help they need? No, in an ideal world, there shouldn’t even be a need for this. But in this kind of world we live in, I think allowing people to safely cross the streams with dignity and peace of mind (after giving it a good try, and concluding that it really can’t be helped) is a small kindness society can give to the suffering.

EDIT: Some proofreading.

I find it more difficult to read text that are short, concise, but using lots of specialized vocabulary. However, a problem about the second choice is making it simple in words, but structured in such a way that ensures both attention and comprehension.

The problem with walls of text, and a problem I also encounter in stuff I write myself, is how there’s just a wall of text. A string of lengthy paragraphs consisting of long sentences that just go on and on without providing the reader a place to pause. That is: a point in which the reader can stop, check for comprehension or just a breather.

Reading such a block of text can be tiring.

I’ve been taught to employ a variety of sentence and paragraph lengths, and try to apply them to my writing. However, this can run the risk of making the result disjointed and rambly. I am guilty of this myself. I realize that this just means I didn’t take the time to collect and organize my thoughts before typing things out. It can be as simple as thinking about what I want to say in the first place, or it can be as involved as thinking about the main point and any supporting points, and how I can lay them out such that they flow neatly in the result.

Longer texts can be improved with just a bit more care in their composition, and without it, walls of text are definitely a chore to read.

EDIT:

I should proofread before hitting post.

You’ve convinced me to give Matrix another try. I’ve made an account on the flagship instance and perhaps I’ll explore around for a while.

I tried using both, in an effort to migrate from Discord. However, after a period of trying to figure out a good workflow and set-up in Matrix—finding an “instance” to set-up an accounts, configuring a private room for me and my SO to have a private chat in, and all that—we just gave up when the instance we had accounts in just folded.

I would have wanted to move to Matrix but I’m just too smooth-brained for it, and so in Discord I stay (keeping in mind that it’s neither private nor safe to be there).

I think it’s safe to say that when you can no longer look at the grains of sand and immediately know how many grains it is, it starts being a pile. For me, that number is around a dozen. Let’s just put it at 10 for a nice clean round number.

I stumbled upon this thread and got really confused. Do people usually have sweaty feet? I tend not to wear socks except when I wear shoes. Otherwise, I wear slippers or go barefoot. Even when I wear shoes, I don’t notice any sweating in my feet. I usually wear cotton socks though.

To answer the OP, though, my rule is to not reuse socks with a couple of exceptions:

• if I only had the socks (with the shoes on) for less than a couple of hours, I think it’s safe to reuse the socks.

• if for some reason, I go to a place where I need to take my shoes and socks off (like if I go visit a friend) I would reuse the socks, of course.

Most of the time though, I just don’t bother with shoes and socks if I can get away with it. It’s too hot where I live to deal with socks.

Yeah. And I’m just throwing what I think is a reasonable idea, but there’s this nagging feeling I’ve got inside that goes “how can you be so sure no one’s thought about it before? Maybe there’s something more pertinent and basic that stops them from doing just that?”

That’s supposed to be part of their job, right? Along with coordinating the dev team’s efforts: who works on which, which aspects of the project is to be prioritized, which bugs are to be fixed ASAP; and other things that doesn’t come to mind at the moment.

But what I am actually imagining when I made that reply is on the other side of the “business-dev” divide. I’m actually thinking of someone who’s leading the QA team? I guess? I don’t even have any idea how it all works out on large corporate software projects.

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Yeah, that’s a good point, but the readmes that I’ve seen written by those who wrote the code themselves are not much better. Sure, they know what it’s all about, which is precisely why it oftentimes isn’t much help for a user.

What’s needed is someone who’d read the initial readme (written by the guy who wrote the code itself) and ask questions about the parts that were “too straightforward” to be included, or weren’t explained clearly enough, or to bring down the general overview back to Earth.

And if there’s yet another person who’d go over this second pass, and keep it from being too dumbed down, even better. Keep it to the level of the average user. That requires knowing the kind of person who’d likely use the program.

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