• conditional_soup@lemm.ee
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    1
    ·
    edit-2
    2 months ago

    I remember debating with my buddy (he’s pro-Russia) about the Ruso-Ukrainian war when it broke out, and my saying how Russia invading Ukraine because of Nazi gangs is a pretty flim flam excuse for a land grab. “It would be like the US invading Mexico and seizing territory because of the drug cartels”, I said. Why is my country this way.

    • jeffw@lemmy.worldOPM
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      0
      arrow-down
      1
      ·
      2 months ago

      Pretty cringe that you know someone who parrots Russian govt talking points though

        • SirDerpy@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          0
          arrow-down
          1
          ·
          2 months ago

          Every ML and hexbear

          That’s not been my experience with either. Are comments like the above kids on the internet, bots, or something else? Someone please explain the contrast between my perception and the mainstream perception of this community.

          An ML would believe Russia is wrong to invade because it’s an imperialistic land grab. They reject NATO because it’s also a tool of imperialism.

          While I don’t spend a lot of time on hexbear, I’ve enough presence to know that advocating an imperialistic land grab (be it by Russia or NATO) or for any authoritarian form of governance (be it “tankie” communism or christo-fascism) will get a user banned quickly.

          • Klear@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            1
            ·
            2 months ago

            While I don’t spend a lot of time on hexbear, I’ve enough presence to know that advocating an imperialistic land grab (be it by Russia or NATO) or for any authoritarian form of governance (be it “tankie” communism or christo-fascism) will get a user banned quickly.

            Right, like this comment that got deleted for calling out Russian imperialism.

            Wait. That’s the complete opposite of what you were claiming.

            • SirDerpy@lemmy.world
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              0
              arrow-down
              1
              ·
              edit-2
              2 months ago

              Right, like this commentthat got deleted for calling out Russian imperialism.

              That’s a great example of exactly what I mean. I enjoyed reading the nuanced perspectives in context in the comments below. I agree with some of the points people made, disagree with others, and now have a better idea of how complex the local situation is in the past decade leading to war.

              I learned that the core point in an argument for Russian invasion is that it was the majority will of the local people to defect from Ukraine to the Russian Federation, with or without sovereignty afterwards. And, I learned how to defeat that argument and its related points fairly soundly. Those couple of overly bleeding hearts were respectfully handled by the vast majority.

              So, thanks for the link, I guess.

              • spacesatan@lemm.ee
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                0
                arrow-down
                1
                ·
                edit-2
                2 months ago

                Stop acknowledging that there is any nuance whatsoever wrt the invasion of ukraine, you’re scaring the libs.

                edit: self determination? never heard of it. Surely it can’t be that both sides suck (unequally) because neither cares what the actual inhabitants of the disputed territory want. Russia is ontologically evil so if you identify as russian you don’t deserve rights.

                If the dispute was reversed the libs would be cheering for the brave Ukrainian separatist fighters and the liberatory Ukrainian invasion.

    • UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      0
      arrow-down
      1
      ·
      edit-2
      2 months ago

      Why is my country this way.

      Wars are traditionally pitched as “defensive” from their native soil. Vietnam was justified by the Gulf of Tonkin incident. WW2 was justified by Pearl Harbor. Iraq and Afghanistan were justified by 9/11. Or Benghazi was for Libya. Etc, etc. Now Trump is arguing that cartel violence on the border justifies invading Mexico. Only a matter of time before they can point to a Missing White Woman or a drug bust or shoot out that can be used to justify moving troops over the border.

      Russia isn’t any less immune to this logic, and the War in the Donbas was as hot an issue to capitalize on as anything Americans experienced with Panama in the 80s or Cuba in the 60s.

      Same with China and Taiwan. Or the civil wars in Sudan and Ethiopia. This isn’t in any way a uniquely American problem.