• vzq@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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        4 months ago

        Sorry to report, hydrogen is also hopeless. It’s cool tech, but making it work in practice is hopeless because it diffuses straight through every container you try and keep it in, and achieving reasonable energy densities requires cryogenic storage.

        Also, developments have been stalling out relative to electrical solutions because of this and because of the heavy investment in electrics.

        I can only see it really working in practice in niche applications where you will be close to cryogenic facilities.

        • Resonosity@lemmy.world
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          4 months ago

          Locking hydrogen up in ammonia is what the industry looks to be moving to to avoid the problem you describe.

          Also, look up the 7 Hydrogen Hubs in the US as an example of this market getting started. There are no downsides to developing a hydrogen market if we’re going to have oodles of excess renewable energy.

          • vzq@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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            4 months ago

            Locking hydrogen up in ammonia is what the industry looks to be moving to to avoid the problem you describe.

            I believe we’re still using more hydrogen to make industrial ammonia than that we produce from green sources, so I guess even if we only switch over ammonia production without worrying about fuel cells or hydrogen vehicles or power generation, we still come out ahead.

            Then there’s the hydrogen used in oil refining that, iirc, is still mostly sourced from methane, but I’m hesitant to suggest we replace that with green hydrogen since if you want to be carbon-negative the oil refining will have to go down A LOT anyway.

            Anyway, I guess my point is that hydrogen is an important commodity for all sorts of things. Before we start burning it for energy it’s easier to use it as is in industrial processes. The methane we save that way (that would be used to produce industrial hydrogen) we can burn as is in existing gas power plants.

            But this is the kind of pragmatic common sense thing that gets no one excited.

    • Frokke@lemmings.world
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      4 months ago

      In the summer. In ideal conditions. Lets talk again once you’ve tried 12 continuous months in the heavily populated northern hemisphere. 😉

    • cqst@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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      4 months ago

      100% renew

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_renewable_electricity_production

      All the countries that manage 100% renewable power use high levels of hydropower. Which is not an option for many countries and has it’s own ecological problems associated with it.

      Also, these 100% renewable countries have very little electricity requirements.

      https://www.eia.gov/energyexplained/electricity/electricity-in-the-us-generation-capacity-and-sales.php

      The United States produces at least produces four million Gigawatt hours of electricity per year. Compare that to some of these “100% renewable” countries.

      • Sure, most countries that already made it use hydro. But Denmark is already up tp 80% without hydro, and the UK and Germany are already nearly halfway there without any meaningful hydro. And there’s still so much solar and wind that can still be installed. They’re nowhere near their maximum production capacity yet.

        100% from renewables is clearly feasible and achievable. Of course it takes time and investments, but nuclear energy will takre more time and investments to get going again.

      • Frokke@lemmings.world
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        4 months ago

        Oh noes, facts. The bane of all renewables evangelicals…

        Just wait till you have to tell them they’re looking at irrelevant data. Not only are they using specific usecases that are not applicable to a large majority of countries, but they’re also using data that doesn’t support the long term fossil fuel goals.

        Just wait till you tell them how much the electricity requirements will skyrocket once we’re transitioning to EV, dropping fossil fuel heating, cooking, cargo trucks switch to EV, etc etc.