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Seems like covid’s overall impact on society won’t be as long lived as we thought. The whole work from home thing was almost seen as revolutionary as it would save office space and expenses. But it seems companies care far more for control than even profit.
Companies want profit but the people who run them want control. Sooner or later the companies will reconfigure themselves to benefit the bottom line.
Don’t give up so easily
I drive by the Boeing strike every day and I do my part and I hunk twice quickly! Do your part guys! Hunk! It matters!
It’s not your job today, but it could be you there tomorrow at 8am wet and soggy from the rain and fog that continually falls in the PNW.
Honk like you just crashed on that big barrel of stuff burning. They burn stuff to stay dry and warm. It’s cold out here…not yet but give two more months and it will be freezing temps.
We can’t really give up. But I am a shit activist…
Cool, glad I didn’t listen to my parents, who wanted me to work for Amazon. Yeah, I probably could’ve made a ton more, but I’m making plenty where I’m at.
I work 2x in office, less if I have a somewhat passable reason to not go in. And I can WFH for a few weeks at a time if I need to travel for whatever reason. It’s nice working for someone that somewhat respects me.
“Probably could’ve made a ton more” - no chance of that working for Amazon.
You dodged a lot of pain and loooong hours, 7 days a week.
I work 2x in office, less if I have a somewhat passable reason to not go in. And I can WFH for a few weeks at a time if I need to travel for whatever reason.
For now. Soon it’s going to be: “Well, Amazon is calling people back, maybe we should, too.”
Well, the day my boss says that is the day I submit my 2 weeks notice, and probably half of our dept. We were hired with the promise of always having 3 days at home most days, and my boss kept to that, even pushing back against company policy that tried to shift to 3 days in office.
Wasn’t there talk of a mass strike in the U.S., at some point? We should do that.
They should be charged an emissions tax and worker safety tax since driving to/from work is one of the leading causes of death for working adults
The beatings will continue until moral improves.
God I hate Amazon now. They’re basically Wal-Mart these days with half the results being sponsored (advertisements) - and you see that even if you pay for Prime. There are some things you can only get there, but otherwise, since all e-commerce is converging, I don’t see the point of enabling their bad behavior. But whichever global corporate enterprise you take your business to, they will likely have a similar mindset.
And the search engine is shit, with non-existent filters. So you browse for longer and buy more shit you never needed.
I really love to work from home. But I also understand IT security is dramatically complicated by user’s working on their private network connection or even private client devices. Teamwork also suffers noticably in some professions.
But I also understand IT security is dramatically complicated by user’s working on their private network connection.
It really isn’t.
Confident. I like that.
It’s the type of confidence that comes with years of experience in IT security and compliance for global enterprises.
Likewise :) Sad to learn you are one of those that act confidentially while being blind. I’m the guy that cleans up after you.
Oh no you don’t, not likewise. There’s zero chance you have any real world experience under your belt, that much you’ve made very clear. You’ve already let it slip that you’re just a consultant lol. A glorified salesman playing around in SMB land no doubt. At best, maybe an old fart who actually dipped his toes into IT generalism two decades ago before getting out of the game and into consulting? I know the type lol.
It’s probably best if you were to stay in your lane and let the professionals worry about security.
Exactly. We use a VPN to connect to anything somewhat important, and anything truly important requires manual access and approvals. I’m in a pretty senior dev position, and if I lost my laptop:
- they’d have to break my password or biometric login (disk is encrypted) - with this they get access to most of our code, but no secrets
- they’d need to hack my phone to access any internal documentation or test environments due to 2FA
- they’d need to hack my password manager to access anything non-documentation - code repos, prod logs, etc
- they’d need to hack someone else’s machine to get access to actual prod data, which is probably what they really want
And I’m not doing anything special here (and I’m certainly not a security professional), that’s everyone’s machines due to company policy. We also don’t handle anything particularly sensitive, the most sensitive thing I have is proprietary algorithms, and we’d sue anyone if we suspected they stole our code.
Oh, and if they try to run something sus, it’ll send a report to our IT dept. I actually got contacted by our IT dept because I ran something unfamiliar (I really like my CLI tools), so they added an exception after personally verifying with me that it’s not a hack.
We have teams across the globe, both inside the org and outside, and we haven’t had any issues with security, and we do regular audits. Our security team isn’t particularly special either, I’m sure many other companies have much tighter security than we do.
I work in telecomms, major strategic projects. I dont have an office to return to, for 9 years I have had no office. My computer can be wiped remotely amd requires 2fa to connect to the vpn.
We have never had a security incident that wasnt someone’s laptop being stolen.
Dont boot lick. This is not rocket science.
So how did those laptops get stolen? Would that have been possible if their users worked on a local client at the office?
Rocket science is a fucking joke compared to secure IT practices. You saying that, proves that you know neither well enough to participate in this discourse. Most users would operate more securely if their client device was also physically restricted. If you don’t understand that, that’s the reason you are not making decisions. I’m sorry to be so blunt.
There are highly capable technical people that can securely work from home, but this is not the average user. If you don’t recognize that, you are probably just cheering for your own personal comfort right now. I get comfort, but don’t be blind to reality
So how did those laptops get stolen? Would that have been possible if their users worked on a local client at the office?
Yes laptops can be stolen from offices. It would be pretty trivial to do so in fact in most cases. In an all on site office it’d be a juicy target too because now all these laptops are in the same place.
Rocket science is a fucking joke compared to secure IT practices. You saying that, proves that you know neither well enough to participate in this discourse.
It is abundantly clear that you have little to no knowledge or experience in modern IT security practices. And before you ask, no, having watched Mr. Robot all the way through does not count.
There are highly capable technical people that can securely work from home, but this is not the average user.
You absolutely do not have to be highly technical to work securely from home. That’s just silly. You only need highly technical people to ensure the people who work from home can do so securely.
pretty trivial to do so
Yup. We have to “badge in” to our office, but the secretary will buzz you in if you ask nicely. Also, if you walk in with confidence as someone is entering/leaving, they’ll hold the door for you. Or go in around the EOD when the cleaning staff are there and they’ll let you in. All it takes is a very small amount of social engineering and you could steal a ton of stuff from my company.
But most people don’t lose stuff like laptops at home or in their office, they lose them when traveling. Maybe you drop by a coffee shop on the way to work and someone filches your bag, or maybe you take a flight for work and someone swipes it while you’re throwing something in the trash. They’re not going to break into your home or your office, they’ll snatch it while you’re out in public and not paying particularly close attention.
Yeah but this guy is a “consultant” he is here to fix your “situation”
🤡
Did chatgpt write this shite lol
Just because you can perform a job from home, doesn’t mean it’s ideal for performance. With jobs like surgeons or bus drivers it’s more obvious, but the cut is not as clear as people like it to be.
I would hope it doesn’t take you long to imagine someone who has access to information about you where you would prefer it not be open on their laptop on their kitchen table at home while guests are around.
I’m not trying to defend Amazon. This is an active subject at many companies.
Security starts at the developer, you have to be deluded to think otherwise.
NDA, bulletproof’ed laptops, kernel-level-oversight, VPNs are just mitigations.
Everything is just mitigations. There is no zero risk.
You are making up theoriticla situations to shill your point… Why are you bootlickong this hard?
If job requires in person, market it as such and hire as such. Pretending that 90% of paper pushers need office is disingenous at best
I work in consulting. I don’t have to make up anything. Be angry, but some people are trying to play their role in capitalism successfully.
I work in consulting.
Haha lol OK? Literally notorious bootlickers… I hope you are a partner. Because otherwise you are bootlicking for against yourself
Be angry, but some people are trying to play their role in capitalism successfully.
Yes everybody here who doesn’t agree with you is a poor entry level employee from a shiti state U.
🤡🤡🤡
I’m not talking about myself in your last quote. I consult clients on their operational and technological challenges. I see a lot. Of course, you might also consult similar amounts of clients and you can see that their largest deficit contributor is that people aren’t taking their work home, but that’s not what I’m getting from you.
You just seem angry, because you can’t stomach that there are valid reasons for you to move out of your comfort zone. Sorry.
You keep trying to make this about me?
Why?
We are talking a corporate policy…
Weird angle to argue.
Also tells me you have no point beyond shilling this.
Generally? That’s bad leadership.
Trying to make those yearly office space rentals worth it
Aren’t they still cheaper if nobody uses them?
Maybe. Real estate is flaky game at best
Inb4 my company follows suit. Just like they want to with IT, AI, Cloud infrastructure (we own our stack almost entirely).
Good guy Amazon: Makes employees return in-person to prevent them from using proprietary remote work software.
Maybe somebody has some insight into this: why does this succeed in getting people to quit, since that’s the obvious gambit? Why do people not just refuse to come back and get fired for insubordination or whatever? Do you not get unemployment benefits for getting fired for that reason (ignoring that unemployment is a pittance compared to their salaries), or are they packaging these people out with attractive severances or something?
They need to find their next job first
Always
Because people need stable incomes and healthcare, so they start applying for jobs and get them. People aren’t quitting to be unemployed.
It’s usually just enough severance to make it worth it. It’ll be like a month of pay maybe which is worth 6-8 months of unemployment.
And honestly…if they offer a month or two of health insurance on top, you have to take to avoid the cobra fees.
It’s usually an easy choice to take severance.
Honestly, IDK. My company is moving their office slightly further away from me. This will add much more commute time because of the location though. I’m already looking for a new job but if I don’t find one by then I’m certainly not going in. We worked 100% remote for over 3 years. I’ll find out what the consequences are.
My situation will be a bit different though since the office location is moving. Seems unreasonable that they’d be able to deny unemployment because of that.
Depending on the country you live in, you should check for mobility clauses in your contract. In many EU countries moving the location of your work requires an employer to come to a “reasonable” agreement with the employer or treat the request as a redundancy (with redundancy pay etc).
Ok, but I’m still not going back to wearing pants.
That’s gonna be a no, dawg.
I enjoy how Amazon talks a big game about how great they are for the environment and their pledge to stop climate change, then they force workers to commute to the office who have been happily doing their jobs over the internet.
They illegally fired the very employees who led the effort to pressure the company internally to do more on climate… All their climate posturing ever since has been bullshit.
It’s easy to terminate staff when you keep the real reasons hushed.
Hard to prove discrimination, union busting or workplace bullying when all you gotta do is set unrealistic targets, PIP those who fail to meet their goals and push them out through disciplinary/capability processes.
It’s how I got scapegoated for department-wide failings and shitcanned from Teleperformance years ago…
Yah this is literally the most basic shit any company can do to be more “green”, cut costs, have access to a larger worker base…
Nope. Because the CEOs are all more concerned with the commercial real estate market than running their company efficiently.
Because the CEOs are all more concerned with the commercial real estate market than running their company efficiently.
It’s shocking how many people have honestly bought this. I mean, I’m sure there is some truth to it and maybe somewhere, someone forced people to come back because of some real estate interests… But the CEO of Amazon almost certainly gains to benefit much more from a rise in price of Amazon stock than any real estate they might own. And even if it was the case, I dont think the board would be very happy about it.
It might be the wrong move, and maybe it is being done to get people to quit, but it’s being done because they think it means more money from Amazon.
I think they are mostly doing this as a stealth layoff. It’s been a pretty popular strategy lately.
Yeah and this whole agenda of RTO rolled out worldwide directly after Davos 2023 when a bunch of CEOs were tweeting about it from there. But noticing this makes you a conspiracy theorist.
The joke is, you get the good people to leave first this way. Be it estate or layoff, it’s a bad move either way.
So why do they do it still? Only thing i can think of is the powerplay. CEO types are sometimes as developed as a child, mentally.
Also Andy Jassey does not look like he is able to effectively groom himself, so that tracks.
Because from you run a mega corp, you don’t care about talent. You need complaint slaves!
cutting head count without “firing” people. standard capitalism bullshit.
stop using amazon. let it rot.
Yup. They want people to quit.
Which works fine as long as you don’t mind keeping your worst employees, while all your best ones quit, which is generally the opposite of how it works during layoffs
It does also work for them that they retain employees who are more likely to put up with their bullshit. They can cull the truly lazy ones at a later date as required, either by firing them or finding a similarly bullshit change that they’re likely to be adverse to.
That links says only a quarter did it because they wanted people to quit, so it suggests that chances are this is not the reason Amazon is doing it…and you’re posting while claiming it factually proves this is their motivation? Pretty deceiving.
I personally read this as “one quarter admit they did it to get people to quit”. If you think these folks are always transparent and honest, think again. They’re just trying to say whatever gets them the least amount of bad PR
This is effectively a layoff without benefits.
Your position hinges on the survey not being anonymous. I clicked through and found nothing that claims it was not anonymous, and these things are normally done anonymously for exactly the reason you point out: less honesty.
Do you have anything to back this up or is it simply that holding this belief helps confirm what you already believe to be true?
It’s easy to avoid buying things from Amazon. It’s hard to avoid AWS. It would be insane to try to suss out what provider everyone that I buy stuff from uses, and their third party relationships. Regulation is better.
It’s easy to avoid buying things from Amazon
I mean… Yes but also no.
Amazon have gone to crap in recent years and has become a more upmarket Wish or Temu. Much of their storefront is full of Chinese knock-off brands these days.
What Amazon does offer is somewhat reliable next (and sometimes same) day delivery. The only way you can get something faster is by travelling to a brick & mortar shop and buying in person.
As for AWS, aren’t we forgetting that Microsoft, IBM, Oracle, Google, even Alibaba and Huawei have their own cloud solutions?
In the old days people used to have their own servers…
And you can still buy them…
And the cloud really isn’t cheaper…
But whatever, it’s ubiquitous today. Maybe someday people will wake the F up.
The best way to do this is to correlate downtime with main providers. If a cloud provider goes down when AWS has outages on related services, it’s probably using an AWS service.
Exactly. This is just more failures of govt to constrain and regulate.
Yep, try browsing with ublock origin blocking all Amazon domains. Lots of things break because AWS is so large.
