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So they got all that money from Uncle Sam’s CHIPS Act only to lay off 10,000 employees and make themselves “lean”. Govt funded unemployment.
This sort of thing is increasingly making TSMC a monopoly as a fab. Due to the extreme economies of scale, fabbing looks like something that is hard to do well under the capitalist model. Perhaps a good time for some of the larger nations of the world to start publicly owned fabs (that publish their research instead of hoarding it) instead of ending up with the whole world reliant on one company that will eventually be able to name its price.
While i dont like intel, I hope they wont sack GPU division.
They won’t. That’s their springboard into that multi trillion dollar AI market everyone keeps talking about
unless some MBA decides that it’s better to sell single purpose expensive ai boards without video output
So, buying opportunity?
“Here is more evidence that our system is fundamentally broken and doesn’t serve the people who make it run anymore”
You: “How can I profit from this?”
You sound like a CEO in the making.
I mean, stock prices do go up after stuff like this. It’s a reliable way to profit.
The system sucks, but this is literally how rich people turn money into more money, while we complain we don’t have enough.
I may be a socialist, but I live in a capitalist dystopia, so sometimes I just exploit the system that exists instead of constantly taking the idealistic high road and getting kicked in the teeth for it.
Even Marx dabbled in the equities markets.
People seem to think having an economic philosophy is the same as having a moral philosophy. Absolutely not. If you look at a system and conclude “This is dysfunctional, it’s leaking money everywhere” that doesn’t preclude you from getting a sponge and mopping some of that money up.
Man I really should’ve bought some Intel instead of Nvidia.
Wait, their stock is 30% down today, what happened?
The entire stock market is a casino for rich people and the rest of us are just hoping we can scratch a retirement out of it?
Yeah, I guess.
Would be awesome if DARPA bought them…
Probably just keeping the staff needed to replace all the 13th and 14th gen CPUs.
I really hope they plan on fixing the problems with those generations. 🤞
They aren’t fixing shit since the problem is unfixable
The problem is fixable in microcode -if- it hasn’t already caused damage to the CPU. Most CPUs are fucked.
It sounds like a workaround, not a fix. And it’s not clear that it stops the processor degradation, rather than just slowing it.
There’s no such thing as stopping processor degradation, it’s just that it usually takes so long that nobody cares anymore.
The micro code fix is to throttle the CPU. It’s only kind of a fix.
And the “fix” (big foam helmet) is not even out yet. They don’t have the chips to replace them all right now and are still selling more. You can help yourself by setting the clock speed (no boost) yourself.
Oh and after the foam helmet gets put on they will still sell these using the old higher specs.
I suppose I should’ve phrased it as, compensating. Seeing as they are still being sold.
American companies don’t compensate unless legally obligated.
And then they send you a $10 Uber Eats card.
They just want you to wat out of their hand so you don’t have a standing to sue.
Didn’t expect CHIPS to backfire this fast lol.
Chips Act, Take 1: Hey Intel here’s 8 Billion dollars to make us more chips in the US. Intel: I gotta let 15,000 of you go, there’s just not enough money…
I thought they would be more tacit about it. This is too obvious and too soon after taking taxpayers’ money. But they probably don’t care anyways. Who is going to stop them or hold them accountable?
It got us a TSMC fab, soon ish maybe lol
The CHIPS plants just started being built a few months ago. This is bad for the employees and short-term investors, but long-term Intel will be fine and the plants will be a net positive to the country.
Is this really a backfire? My read is that they’re actually focusing on their core business (plus cutting down marketing). It sounds like the right move, but maybe I’m too optimistic?
I don’t think it backfired…I truly don’t believe the Chips act is a jobs act. It is to address manufacturing gaps in semiconductors within the US. The US government wants semiconductor manufacturers to update foundries and gave them money to do so. The jobs that have been added within the industry have been icing on the cake but not the original intent imho.
How long before Nvdia buys them, or at least tries to. Nvidia tried to buy Arm but got stopped by the UK government.
Nvidia wants IP. They do not want to buy foundries. It’s too volatile and dependent on government subsidies while also being well outside their core competencies. If their products don’t sell as a fabless company, they don’t see growth and lose on the manufacturing cost. If their products don’t sell and their chip fabs run idle, they lose a shitton of money on not just the above but also the cost of maintaining the fabs.
Arm is worth 5.3bn USD and employs just over 8000 people. Intel is worth just over 100bn USD and employs 124,000 people.
Nvidia is worth 42bn USD and employs 30,000 people.
That makes Intel over twice as valuable as Nvidia with over four times as many employees.
Don’t understand your “worth” numbers, that’s generally market cap and those numbers don’t line up. The employee counts line up…
100B is… close enough for Intel (though they have fallen to 95B). So $730,769 per employee
ARM is $140B… So $20,000,000 an employee…
nVidia is worth 2.7T… $90,000,000 an employee…
Nvidia is worth 42bn USD and employs 30,000 people.
Nvidia’s has a market cap 30x of Intel’s. So it could issue more stock to raise capital for a buyout. It’s not the company equity but the market cap that it needs to have money to purchase. Even a controlling stake of > 50% would give them defacto control. Of course governments & regulators would probably block it or force Nvidia to divest bits of itself, and that’s probably the greatest protection Intel has against such a scenario.
But if Intel weakens further, it may well be someone else tries to acquire it. I bet a lot of companies would love to snaffle it up. It’s kind of ironic that Intel used to be the big dog in the semiconductor space but even AMD is bigger than it these days and are potentially many others who’d like buy it out. In fact, for all we know Intel might be shedding all these jobs to make it look more attractive to potential buyers.
The thing is that AMD and Nvidia are chip designers not chip makers. While Intel does design and print chips, the reason Intel is so critical (from US perception) is they own the foundries to make chips.
AMD decided years ago to go fabless, as for Nvidia I’m not sure they want to own the fabrication process.
stop ‘non-essential’ work
So those jobs they’re cutting start with everyone with “Chief” in their title, right?
Of course not. The Chiefs earn every penny by making the difficult decisions to keep stock prices up. /s
Lets hope they ditch the israel division
Why that specifically?
Boycott Divest Sanction
It’s not necessarily the thread to bring it up but linkerbaan is on a mission.
Because Intel takes American subsidies, so it would be best to keep the money circulating in America by providing jobs to Americans. Not subsidize some Apartheid in the Middle East.
Linkerbaan isn’t capable of any discussion that doesn’t involve Israel, and must involve it in any thread he participates in no matter how irrelevant. This is just what he does.
I wonder how irrelevant Intel is to israel
Intel Israel is the largest private employer in the Israeli hi-tech
Also nice false framing and straight up lying about my activity on Lemmy.
Let’s hope they ditch.
So the semiconductor jobs and manufacturing isn’t coming back to the US?
Who else saw this coming? Because I did.
I remember telling people that and they wouldn’t believe it. Time has a way of making the unknown known.
Read article
I read it and predicted this outcome in 2022. If Intel wanted to open factories and employ people in the US it would have done so without the CHIPS Act.
No company will say no to free taxpayers’ money, so they didn’t. But they spent it on stock buybacks and now they’re laying off thousands of workers and are selling a defective product.
Now here’s an article for you to read that may be unpalatable https://globalsouth.co/2023/07/10/michael-hudson-why-the-u-s-economy-cannot-re-industrialize/
Fair criticisms, but the statement from CEO is that the layoffs are to offset fab investments, so there isn’t any clear reason to conclude that Intel’s US chip manufacturing is dead based on this. We won’t be able to infer anything of that sort until we see what areas they actually cut.
Future promises vs present actions. Only time will tell.
There’s a dude in wallstreetbets who dumped a $700k inheritance into Intel stocks. lol
Layoffs usually cause the stock prices to increase because it shows the company is being “lean” and “cutting the fat”.
Yeah, Intel is down 33% over the last two days… didn’t work this time…
Some layoffs can be seen as “improving efficiency”. This deep of cut is “oh shit, things are screwed”.
It has me oddly hopeful. It sounds like they may have finally realized that they can’t ignore their core product/purpose. However, whether it’s too late or if they have the ability to actually execute is still to be seen.
Frankly, no idea. They talked the talk, but it’s vague enough that I wouldn’t be surprised if they cut out some important people and kept a lot of the bogus crap.
Speaking from a company that has seen (less dramatic) rhetoric around similar circumstances, and everyone on the ground who understood nuance would have guessed certain projects to get canned. Then it turns out they treated the money losing projects as the sacred cows and cut the profitable projects to the bone and put them at risk rather than give up the losers.
Dude, what the heck is wrong with people. Wealth is wasted on the stupid.
its mainly that our modern culture worships money and things whoever has more of it is inherently better.
So rich people make bad decisions because they think that being rich means they are always right, and that their ideas are special and magical and come from a mystical realm of refined thought only people with stacks of cash possess.
And when they fail, they blame everything except their greed focused short sightedness.
What’s the problem? They put the money back into circulation. That’s a good thing, no?
The wealthy hoard their gold. They don’t circulate it.
The problem is that it is just poor money management. He could’ve been set for life. Put that into an index or S&P500 and get 10% every year. That’s 70k and he wouldn’t even have to work. If you took that 70k and invested back into the fund, you can double your money in about 7 years, assuming 10% returns.
Yeah I agree. That’s what I would’ve done. You saying that wealth is wasted just made it sound like the money dissapeared somehow. He wasted his chance on financial independence, sure, but that’s not away from the rest of us.
He’s gonna make a ton of money then, because investors love layoffs.
The stock is down 30% so far, so I think you may not understand investors very well haha
I had a friend in the '90s who took a $40K inheritance and “invested” it all on $75 Fossil watches, the kind with Popeye and other cartoon characters on them. At least she was able to show them off at parties and get all the guests to go home.
Meh, he bought a significant dip, even if it goes lower in the coming months, in a few years he will be way up. It’s not like Intel will go away, they are in a duopoly market.
Intel has been down from around 50 YTD to 30 likely in a few years it will be back to 50 and he will close to double his money
Though he could have probably just put the 700K into S&P 500 and have his retirement taken care of, since he is in his 20s
Yeah but still… could’ve at least waited a day
Holy F, what an idiot nepo baby. Maybe daddy who pays for college works as a VP at intel
Two generations of bad cpu’s and their solution is get rid of the workers so they can keep their bonuses.
Two words, bean counters.
Gotta keep that angle at 45° forever and ever.
MBA brain rot
Part of the lackluster CPU problem is that Intel was pissing away their money on other adventures. CPUs were “in the bag”, so they kept spending money on other stuff to try to “create new markets”. Any casual observer knew their fundamental problem was simple: they got screwed on fabrication tech. Then they got screwed again as a lot of heavy lifting went to the ‘GPU’ half of the world and they were the only ones with zero high performance GPU product/credibility. But they instead went very different directions with their investments…
For example they did a lot to try to make Optane DIMMs happen, up to and including funding a bunch of evangelism to tell people they’ll need to rewrite their software to use entirely new methods of accessing data to make Optane DIMMs actually do any better than NAND+RAM. They had a problem where if it were treated like a disk, it was a little faster, but not really, and if it were used like RAM it was WAY slower, so they had this vision of a whole new third set of data access APIs… The instant they realized they needed the entire software industry to fundamentally change data access from how they’ve been doing it for decades for a product to work should have been the signal to kill it off, but they persisted.
See also adventures in weird PCIe interconnects no one asked for (notably they liked to show a single NVME drive being moved between servers, which costed way more than just giving each server another NVME and moving data over a traditional fabric). Embedding FPGA into CPUs when they didn’t have the thermal budget to do so and no advantages over a discrete FPGA. Just a whole bunch of random ass hardware and software projects with no connection to business results, regardless of how good or bad they were. Intel is bad for “build it, and they will come”.
I wish them brain drain for being such greedy. Let their best people leave to better pastures.
What’s crazy to me is that they are laying off more employees than the total number of full time employees I’ve work at for most companies.
They are laying off 12% of their work force.
… the 12 percent that actually does something too…
That’s what happens when companies are too fucking big, and intel was essentially a monopoly for a while.
I have interned at AT&T while at University, laying off a 1000 people would be less than 1 % for them.
After seeing this article I went down a rabbit hole and IBM isn’t even in the top 10 US of most employees. Here’s some of the popular ones from the top 30.
- Walmart - 2.3 Million
- Amazon - 1.61 Million
- DHL - 594,000
- FedEx - 547,000
- UPS - 536,000
- Home Depot - 456,000
- Target - 415,000
- Kroger - 414,000
- Marriott - 411,000
- Starbucks - 381,000
- Walgreens - 333,000
- Pepsi - 318,000
- Costco - 316,000
- Chase - 309,000
- Lowes - 300,000
- IBM - 282,000
- CVS - 219,000
- Bank of America - 212,000
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_United_States–based_employers_globally
…i’m surprised to see DHL rank so highly in that list: what’s their domestic market focus, business-to-business freight logistics?..i seldom see DHL packages and when i do they’re almost exclusively of international origin…
FIFTEEN THOUSAND HOLY SHIT
What the actual fuck
I wonder how many of the over 1000 VPs will get canned. You read that right. I worked there at the beginning of my career. I know a lot of people who are now VPs. Only one of them was actually any good. One guy couldn’t even manage his own staff meetings when he was a first line manager. Nice guy, not dumb or anything, but not brilliant, and a terrible organizer.
over 1000 VPs
I used to work for Comcast and it was astonishing how many vice presidents there were. It might be the most meaningless corporate title ever. Even if they had real work to do they never had time to do it - VPs there turned over faster than beignets at Cafe du Monde.
Ah yes, the ol’ “promoted to the level of their incompetence”. SOP. Or SNAFU, take your pick.
I hope this never happens to me but based on the Peter Principle I won’t know when it happens.
Oh shit maybe it’s already happened…
